Posts by Nathan Natas

Sir82 pointed out, "The wretched irony of it is, some time in the 90's the WTS reversed course and "alternative service" is now perfectly fine for JWs..."

Also worth noting is that the USA now relies on an ALL VOLUNTEER military; there is no more draft! How convenient!

I'm a member of Brother Terry's "generation" (no overlap, please, we're rational) and like him I faced the draft. I took the same stand he did and I was "lovingly counseled" to EXPECT to spend some time in prison. But I didn't! I pioneered and offered an acceptably articulate defense of my convictions to the draft board. I nearly fell over when my draft board gave me my 4-D ministerial exemption!

Was I better than Brother Terry? HELL NO! To the best of my knowledge neither of us was leading a "double-life." I may even have been closer to being a "doubler" than Brother Terry was - I know my secret transgressions, but not his.

So was this "Jehovah's judgment"? I REJECT that suggestion! There IS NO Jehovah! All there is is unblinking time and uninterested circumstance! Each draft board was unique - it was made of LOCAL men - volunteers - who judged each "draft dodger" against the other juvenile delinquents the draft board had to deal with!

I was in NYC, where my behavior and "godly devotion" may have made me seem saintly next to the punks, thugs, hippies, morphodites and gonzos who lived in my burg.

Bro T, on the other hand, may have been from an area off the country where most kids his age were fairly good citizens, so by contrast his gowns may not have seemed so brilliantly white.

Can you see how 50 years later, I wrestle with a tad of guilt - "survivor's remorse" maybe. If you are not familiar with T's story, do yourself a favor and buy a copy of his book. Like me you may weep by the rivers of Babylon the Greater for the ordeal Terry survived. Then take a moment to think of the THOUSANDS of other 18-year-olds who were convicts of conscience, JW or otherwise. Farkel was one too.

I doubt that anyone who has not faced this can grasp the level of stress this puts on a person. The Watchtower would take a position that they offered ABSOLUTELY NO advice to the 18-year old because they didn't want to find their butts warming Rutherford's cell in the Atlanta Penitentiary, but on the side they would tell you what YOU HAD TO DO to be approved by the Jehovah Sock Puppet. YOU must RESIST! YOU must NOT accept alternate service!

We were the mirror image of Billy Joel's song..

https://youtu.be/R9rG1G-Yr_Q

Hey T, love ya bro, and I'm sorry...

76

Family is now reaping what they sowed and they don't like it.

by Gemmel in

i resigned from the jw's in my 20's over 30 years ago, i was immediately shunned by my entire family and it's remained that way with a few exceptions ever since.

one of those exceptions was being contacted by a cousin a few years back and during that conversation i discovered that my mother had been and still was the prime mover in my complete and continuing shunning.

i then used what contacts i had left to confirm it.

Nathan Natas

I was just reviewing 3rdgen's experience trying to get the WTB&TS to repay a loan. 3rdgen said,

"He wrote 3 letters with NO response so he called the desk asking if the letters had been received. The answer was: Yes, they received them. BUT she had (in her demented state) verbally "forgiven the loan" "Put her on welfare"

I was stunned! the WTB&TS is claiming that they had a VERBAL agreement from a dotard forgiving the loan! That's INCREDIBLE!

If the situation were different - If ordinary Brother Rank-and-File was asked to repay a conditional loan, the WTB&TS would offer the scriptural counsel that the loan SHOULD be repaid because there was NO PROOF it had been forgiven.

And >if< there really WAS a verbal forgiving of the loan, how STUPID is the WTB&TS for not immediately putting one of their attorneys on a plane to get that forgiven loan properly DOCUMENTED!

Wow! The balls on these guys!

76

Family is now reaping what they sowed and they don't like it.

by Gemmel in

i resigned from the jw's in my 20's over 30 years ago, i was immediately shunned by my entire family and it's remained that way with a few exceptions ever since.

one of those exceptions was being contacted by a cousin a few years back and during that conversation i discovered that my mother had been and still was the prime mover in my complete and continuing shunning.

i then used what contacts i had left to confirm it.

Nathan Natas

Ignore the counsel of milquetoasts.

76

Family is now reaping what they sowed and they don't like it.

by Gemmel in

i resigned from the jw's in my 20's over 30 years ago, i was immediately shunned by my entire family and it's remained that way with a few exceptions ever since.

one of those exceptions was being contacted by a cousin a few years back and during that conversation i discovered that my mother had been and still was the prime mover in my complete and continuing shunning.

i then used what contacts i had left to confirm it.

Nathan Natas

For what it is worth, I agree with yourdecision 101.3%! I understand what you've been subjected to and the pain it caused you. Now that their poor planning has paid off so nhandsomly, they expect YOU to fill the GAP. Why? "Well, because we were RIGHT all along, and YOU KNOW IT!" they'd answer.

Let them eat their stale, past-its-pull date coffeecake! It tastes just like all the other Watchtower prophecies -- it tastes like dust!

...and hey! Didn't I see you at the Atheist Church last Thursday?*

* a clever toying with the "Atheism is a religion" and "last Thursday-ism" memes, brought to you by --- me!

77

It's a shame isn't it?

by freddo in

jw
friends

... that this forum, which is such an amazing resource for those needing support for their journey from watchtower's clutches has an increasingly present representation of unreasoning politically charged loudmouths..

Nathan Natas

Freddo said, "...this forum, which is such an amazing resource for those needing support for their journey from Watchtower's clutches has an increasingly present representation of unreasoning politically charged loudmouths."

You need to work on your self-esteem, pal. I don't think you're an unreasoning politically charged loudmouth -- yet.

Why not name names and/or ideologies that you find especially threatening to your delicate world view?

39

Concealed carry Dubs

by scruffmcbuff in

i spent a considerable length of time living and working in america (would love to imigrate one day).. almost everyone i worked with and made friends with carried a concealed firearm of somesort.

i found this pretty interesting and as an avid firearm fan even more so.. so to our american members here... .

as a jw did you or did you know any practising dubs who carried or if not had firearms for home defence?

Nathan Natas

I heard that one of my youthful peer-group worked for a while as a NYC cabbie and carried when he was driving. I don't know if he carried in other places.

I'm now a member of the NRA, so I can't criticize his decision, but back then it would have cause a few eyebrows to arch.

If a person has the right to defend their life, there can't be a limit on the exercise of that right.

If someone says there is a limitation on what is acceptable defense, then it seems to me they're saying I have the right to be at the mercy of a criminal. Who else is gonna save my life? Batman? Jesus?

I'd put my money on Batman.

59

Anyone Tried "Sous Vide" Cooking?

by Simon in

i like a nice steak but cooking one can be a little intimidating and the results hit and miss especially when it comes to getting the right temperature so getting it wrong can be an expensive mistake.

can anyone do that "finger and thumb together to check the doneness" thing?

i can't .... so i came across this cooking technique called "sous vide" which cooks food (in a sealed vacuum bag) in a warm water bath, even steak.

Nathan Natas

Short ribs! I forgot to mention beef short ribs! These come off of the chuck usually, but sometimes you can get the ribs that are left when a boneless prime rib is made. Either one benefits from the "low 'n slow" cooking method favored by most BBQ experts, but a sous-vide will give you super tender meat. If you want smoke flavor, add some Liquid Smoke (I like Wright's), which ideally is just smoke and water. If you want to go gastro-pub, marinate the meat in kalbi spices or kalbi sauce for a taste of the Korean specialty.

Think of those cuts that are generally tough to get tender, and try them turkey drumsticks spring to mind. Again, liquid smoke can be your "underwater BBQ."

Whatever you choose, remember that the step after sous-vide is "SEAR"! This can be done in a HOT skillet or under a HOT broiler. It only adds a couple of minutes to the process but it greatly improves the appearance of the food.

59

Anyone Tried "Sous Vide" Cooking?

by Simon in

i like a nice steak but cooking one can be a little intimidating and the results hit and miss especially when it comes to getting the right temperature so getting it wrong can be an expensive mistake.

can anyone do that "finger and thumb together to check the doneness" thing?

i can't .... so i came across this cooking technique called "sous vide" which cooks food (in a sealed vacuum bag) in a warm water bath, even steak.

Nathan Natas

I like grilled meats as much as the next guy, but when I hear people saying "{the thing I use} is the BEST!"

...what I hear is "I have ONE tool; my shiny drywall hammer. Nothing is better than my drywall hammer for driving screws!"